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Thread: Freezer warming problem

  1. #1

    Freezer warming problem

    Model Number: KSSC36FJS00
    Brand: KitchenAid
    Age: More than 10 years

    About 1 month ago, our freezer in stopped cooling and caused everything inside to melt. Called appliance service and what they did was clean the condenser coils (top of the unit). That appeared to fix the problem but only for a few days. I noticed the freezer would cool down from 32 degrees to 10 degress and stay there for a while and then start to warming up again. Compressor will keep on running (not in defrost cycle) but the freezer temp is going up instead of going down. I would manually turn off the refrigerator (and therefore the compressor) and let it sit for 20 minutes and turn it back on again. The temperature will start to come down again but after 3-4 hours, the freezer temp will rise again to the point that ice would melt. Lately I noticed that the temp in the freezer will only come down to 20 degrees before it starts to warm up again. So the problem seems to be getting worse.

    This is what I have done so far to diagnose the problem:

    1. Condenser coils are clean.
    2. Checked defrost timer and it is working properly. Defrost cycle is about 10 hours apart and lasts for approximately 20 minutes.
    3. Compressor running. No clicking sound that indicates failure.
    4. Checked compressor fan and seems to work just fine.
    5. Checked evaporator fan inside the freezer compartment. Seems to be running just fine.
    6. Checked evaporator coils for frost build-up. No frost in the evaporator coils. Not even a little after several hours.
    7. Suspected perhaps it is a bad Thermostat/Cold Control in the freezer unit control panel. Went ahead and replaced that part. Same cooling problem still exists even with the new Thermostat/Cold Control.
    8. Checked to make sure all air vents in the freezer and fresh food compartment are not blocked.
    9. Checked for leaks in the freezer and refrigerators doors using "dollar bill" test. Seems to be somewhat "loose" in just about every place I used the dollar bill but I am not sure if that really indicates the door rubber gaskets are bad.

    About a week ago, after a defrost cycle, the temperature will go from 30 degrees to about 5 degrees in about 5 hours before the freezer temperature warms up again. All this time, the compressor keeps on running. This week the freezer only goes down to about 17 degrees before the temperature starts to rise again even though the compressor keeps on running.

    Since the freezer is still cooling to a certain degree, it seems the compressor motor is still working. I am at a loss as to why the temperature in the freezer is now having great difficulty getting down to the ideal range of zero degrees Fahrenheit.

  2. #2

    Freezer temperature goes up and down

    Quote Originally Posted by xndrhome View Post
    Model Number: KSSC36FJS00
    Brand: KitchenAid
    Age: More than 10 years

    About 1 month ago, our freezer in stopped cooling and caused everything inside to melt. Called appliance service and what they did was clean the condenser coils (top of the unit). That appeared to fix the problem but only for a few days. I noticed the freezer would cool down from 32 degrees to 10 degress and stay there for a while and then start to warming up again. Compressor will keep on running (not in defrost cycle) but the freezer temp is going up instead of going down. I would manually turn off the refrigerator (and therefore the compressor) and let it sit for 20 minutes and turn it back on again. The temperature will start to come down again but after 3-4 hours, the freezer temp will rise again to the point that ice would melt. Lately I noticed that the temp in the freezer will only come down to 20 degrees before it starts to warm up again. So the problem seems to be getting worse.

    This is what I have done so far to diagnose the problem:

    1. Condenser coils are clean.
    2. Checked defrost timer and it is working properly. Defrost cycle is about 10 hours apart and lasts for approximately 20 minutes.
    3. Compressor running. No clicking sound that indicates failure.
    4. Checked compressor fan and seems to work just fine.
    5. Checked evaporator fan inside the freezer compartment. Seems to be running just fine.
    6. Checked evaporator coils for frost build-up. No frost in the evaporator coils. Not even a little after several hours.
    7. Suspected perhaps it is a bad Thermostat/Cold Control in the freezer unit control panel. Went ahead and replaced that part. Same cooling problem still exists even with the new Thermostat/Cold Control.
    8. Checked to make sure all air vents in the freezer and fresh food compartment are not blocked.
    9. Checked for leaks in the freezer and refrigerators doors using "dollar bill" test. Seems to be somewhat "loose" in just about every place I used the dollar bill but I am not sure if that really indicates the door rubber gaskets are bad.

    About a week ago, after a defrost cycle, the temperature will go from 30 degrees to about 5 degrees in about 5 hours before the freezer temperature warms up again. All this time, the compressor keeps on running. This week the freezer only goes down to about 17 degrees before the temperature starts to rise again even though the compressor keeps on running.

    Since the freezer is still cooling to a certain degree, it seems the compressor motor is still working. I am at a loss as to why the temperature in the freezer is now having great difficulty getting down to the ideal range of zero degrees Fahrenheit.

    Read a few more threads and found something interesting. On the fresh food side of my refrigerator (KitchenAid Model #KSSC36FJS00) is a control panel that has a knob to control the temperature on the fresh food side (non-freezing) of the fridge. There is a clicking sound on the control panel where the knob is. I looked at the schematic of the fridge and behind that knob is an "Electric Circuit Board". Is it possible that board has gone bad especially since it is making a clicking sound? Does that circuit board have anything to do with controlling the temperature on the freezer section as well?

    Is it also possible that even though the evaporator fan is turning, the speed of the evaporator fan is slows down after a while during the cooling cycle so it causes the temperature in the freezer to go up instead of go down?

  3. #3
    Admin/Technician Doc Ryan's Avatar
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    I tried looking for the wiring diagram for your model refrigerator, but I was not able to locate one so I am not sure what the function of that control board is. If the compressor is running then the evaporator coil should have a light even layer of frost across the entire coil within 15-30 minutes of the compressor running. If the coil is not getting cold then you could have a bad compressor or leak in the sealed system.
    Ryan

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  4. #4
    Thanks for the reply. I have a hard copy of the wiring diagram for the refrigerator which I will scan and upload here. This morning the temperature in the freezer went down to ~13 degrees Fahrenheit and stayed within 3 degrees of that temp until the defrost cycle kicked in at which time the temp in the freezer rose to ~27 degrees Fahrenheit. After 20 minutes, the compressor motor, condenser fan, and evaporator fan all turned back on and the temperature in the freezer is now working its way down again. It's been about 2 hours since the last defrost cycle ended, the temperature in the freezer is ~17 degrees Fahrenheit. The temperature in the freezer appears to still be going down.

    If I call an appliance technician, what will they typically do to determine if the compressor is bad or if there is a leak in the sealed system? How many hours does a compressor typically run before it starts to overheat?
    Last edited by xndrhome; 10-31-2014 at 06:09 PM.

  5. #5
    Admin/Technician Doc Ryan's Avatar
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    They will normally look at the evaporator coil to see if the frost pattern looks normal to see if the sealed system and compressor are working properly. If you can, post up a picture of the frost pattern from the evaporator coil after it has been running for 15-30 mins. If the heat is being dissipated from condenser coil and compressor properly, then compressor should not overheat.
    Ryan

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  6. #6
    Thank you very much for your assistance. As far as I can tell, the compressor fan is working properly in that it is dissipating heat from the condenser coils, and the compressor.

    I made yet another very interesting observation over the weekend. Last Friday the temperature in the freezer was varying between 12-17 degrees. The cold control in the freezer was set to 1 (warm). Before going to bed, I decided to set the cold control in the freezer up 1 notch to 2 (colder) to see if the temp in the freezer goes any lower. On Saturday morning the temperature in the freezer was at 6 degrees Fahrenheit. I also noticed that the temperature in the fresh food section went down to 28 degrees Fahrenheit. So what I did was I adjusted the control in the fresh food section down 1 notch expecting the temperature to go up above 30 degrees. The defrost cycle kicked in Saturday morning which brought the temp in the freezer up to 17 degrees. When the defrost cycle was done, the temp in the freezer started to go back down again from 17 but after about 2 hours when the temp in the freezer was 14 degrees, the temperature in the freezer reversed course and started to increase. The compressor motor, evaporator fan and compressor fan are all running and yet the temperature in the freezer is going up. It went all the way up to 32 degrees in the freezer after several hours and stayed there. Checked compressor motor, and fans and they are all running as far as I can tell. The defrost cycle would kick-in which made the temp go up even higher to 37 degrees. After being in defrost mode for 20 minutes, the temp in the freezer would go from 37 to 32 degrees and stay there. I turned off the power a few times waiting 20 minutes each time before turning the unit back on again. The temp in the freezer will go from 37 to 32 degrees and stay there. Again I checked compressor motor, and fans and all are running as far as I can tell.

    My hunch is the adjustment I made to the control in the fresh food section somehow affected the entire system. So I turned off the power one more time and let it rest for 30 minutes. Before turning the power back on, I set the control in the fresh food compartment to the coldest (maximum) setting possible and the control in the freezer to the warmest setting (minimum) possible. I turned the unit back on and watched the temperature in the freezer slowly go down from 37 degrees to 32 degrees, and then it just kept on going down. When the freezer temp reached 13 degrees, another defrost cycle kicked-in. Freezer temp went back up to 24 degrees before it flipped back to cooling mode. Temperature in the freezer again started to come down. This morning, the freezer temperature was as low as 5 degrees Fahrenheit and the fresh food section was at 34 degrees Fahrenheit.

    With the current setting of the freezer control (min cold) and fresh food control (max cold), I noticed the temperature in the freezer would bounce around between 5 degrees and 10 degrees but the compressor motor, evaporator fan, and compressor fan just keeps on running the entire time. I adjusted the control in freezer section up one notch a few hours ago to see if the freezer temperature goes any lower.
    Last edited by xndrhome; 11-03-2014 at 05:40 PM.

  7. #7
    I just checked the status of the fridge. The temperature in the freezer dropped to 3 degrees around 1PM in the afternoon today from a low of 5 degrees before. Then it reserved course and started to go up. By 2PM it was at 7 degrees. It's now 2:45PM and the temperature in the freezer is up to 15 degrees. The temperature rise is not because another defrost cycle kicked in. It is not suppose to go into defrost for another 5 hours. Compressor motor, compressor fan, and evaporator fan are all running but temperature is rising. From 1PM to 2PM, the temperature rose from 3 to 7 degrees. From 2PM to 2:45PM, the freezer temperature went from 7 to 16 degrees so the temperature increase got quicker. When I turn off the power and let it rest for 30 minutes or so, the temperature in the freezer goes up just a few degrees. So something happened or got triggered that is causing the temperature in the freezer to go up rapidly. The evaporator fan which is running must be one factor in the quick freezer temperature rise.

    I read somewhere that if the light bulbs in the compartment don't turn off then it can cause temperatures to rise. I checked the switches that turns the compartment lights on or off when the refrigerator doors are opened or closed and they appear to be functioning perfectly. Since the setting of the temperature control in the fresh food section appears to affect what happens to the temperature in the freezer, is it possible that air from the fresh food section is going into the freezer section which then causes the air temperature in the freezer to go up since air in the fresh food section is warmer than the air in the freezer? I am not sure if or how that is even possible.
    Last edited by xndrhome; 11-03-2014 at 06:12 PM.

  8. #8
    Temperature in the freezer hit 32 degrees and stayed there for a few hours until the defrost cycle came on. That took the temperature in the freezer even higher to 37 degrees. After the defrost cycle, the freezer temperature started to come back down again. It's been 5 hours since the last defrost cycle ended and the freezer temperature is 16 degrees. Still no clue as to what caused the freezer temperature to shoot up from 3 degrees to 32 degrees before the last defrost cycle. Defrost timer, defrost heater, and defrost thermostat as far as I know works fine. I don't notice frost build-up in the evaporator coils between the 10 hour defrost/cooling cycle.

  9. #9
    Admin/Technician Doc Ryan's Avatar
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    I don't think the control board is relating to your problem. The refrigerator gets its cold air from the freezer, and air normally transfers between the freezer and refrigerator sections on a regular basis when the refrigerator is working properly. Please post up a picture of the frost pattern on the evaporator coil after the compressor has been running for 15-30 minutes so we can see if the sealed system is working properly.
    Ryan

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  10. #10
    Here are the images of the evaporator you asked for:

    http://postimg.org/image/40nw05rfp/
    http://postimg.org/image/tj5hj0sg3/
    http://postimg.org/image/79uqatvy5/
    http://postimg.org/image/jgv7dfozl/
    http://postimg.org/image/wldbdr1xp/

    Looks like there is a sealed system problem as you initially indicated. Is this something that can be repaired? A new fridge would be at least $6000 if not more.

  11. #11
    Admin/Technician Doc Ryan's Avatar
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    Thank you for the pictures. In the attached image below the frost in the area that I circled is what the whole evaporator coil should look like when the refrigerator is working properly. Usually this type of problem is caused by a leak in the sealed system. This type of repair can be expensive and it will need to be done by a professional appliance repair person. I would recommend to contact some of the local appliance repair companies in your area.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails IMG_1723.jpg  
    Ryan

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  12. #12
    Can you give a ballpark figure or some kind of average of what the repair will cost? That way when I have someone come over to have a look, and they give me a quote, I at least know what is reasonable. Would a leak in the sealed system also mean the compressor needs to be replaced?

    Thank you so much for your help.

  13. #13
    Admin/Technician Doc Ryan's Avatar
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    A leak in the sealed system does not mean the compressor is bad, but it means that somewhere there is a leak that needs to be found and fixed. I'm sorry, I wouldn't be able to give you a price estimate as these jobs can vary alot depending on what is involved to complete the repair.
    Ryan

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  14. #14
    Replying to this old thread just to give someone an idea of what it costs to open a sealed system. I just got an estimate to charge a system on a Samsung fridge (which involves opening a sealed system) and was told it could cost from $500 - $900. Expensive and quite a range in price. This is in Wichita, Kansas, I'm sure it's more in large cities.

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